Dead On Arrival Seiko watch from SolarCosa (ebay: sun_and_more)

Update March 24

The seller sent an email threatening legal action, if I didn't remove the negative feedback left for them, before March 27th 2020. Needless to say, this really pisses me off: One thing is that the company does not understand the concept of customer service, but to threaten their customer - that takes the prize. I responded that they should seek legal action immediately, as the feedback would not be revised. See the email and my response below in the mail section.

Edit: I see now they only want me to retract my statement that "The watch never worked" - which is difficult, as I did not make that claim in my feedback. What I do say (an is maintaining) is, that the watch did not work when I received it or at any time while I had it in my possession.

Case timeline:

24.02.2020

Ordered a Seiko SNZG13K1 watch from ebay-seller sun_and_more (SolarCosa).

28.02.2020

Received the watch (serial no. 012577), but it did not run when I unpacked it (this is not normal, as the watch has been shaken a lot by the carrier). After letting the watch get to room temperature for an hour, I tried shaking it, shaking it harder, rotating it as hard as I dared to not be responsible for breaking it even more. It that I have 4 other automatic Seiko watches, but not with the same caliber (7S36 in the SNZG13K1) but with calibers 7009, 4206 and 4R35. I have never shaken any of these four watches as much as I did the SNZG13K1, but still, it did not start!

28.02.2020

I contacted the seller the same day (2 hours after receiving the watch) to hear what to do.

03.03.2020

Not being able to use my new watch and not hearing anything from the seller, I opened a "Request return" case with ebay, stating the item was defective.

10.03.2020

Finally! A response from the seller 11 days after the initial message and 7 days after opening the case. The response more less said "There is nothing wrong with the watch, you are just stupid to use it" (not the actual wording, but to the same effect - see the full line of messages below). I stated I was sure it did not work and they asked for me to return the watch. As I now noticed this was a response to the first message, I asked them to respond to the case instead, making them aware that a case was open.

11.03.2020

A response to the case, again stating that I was an idiot, but this time in German (again not the actual wording - see below). However, they agreed to accept a return but not to pay the return postage. I pointed to the law regarding returning a defective item, and they "promised" to look for signs of tear and wear on MY PAID FOR DEFECTIVE WATCH (why should I wear it, but if I did it was my right - it was MY WATCH).

The watch was sent the same evening and a tracking number provided. Proof of return postage was included.

 

16.03.2020

The watch was received by sun_and_more and the provided an unpacking video and now, the watch was working! Yes, it was indeed my returned and was indeed working. From the time on the watch I could deduct, that the watch had been going for either just short of 36 hours, 48 hours or maximum of just below 60 hours (out of 108 hours of transport time). You do the math.

SolarCosa refunded the sales price, excluding the return postage.

20.03.2020 (not entirely sure of the date)

I left negative feedback for the transaction. To be fair, the feedback was negative, but seller ratings was 5 stars for all (Item description, Postage costs and speed of sending the item), except "Communication" which was 1 star. The feedback read: "SNZG13K1 serial 012577 - Item was dead on arrival. But FAST delivery!".

21.03.2020 (again not entirely sure - ebay does not list dates for these messages)

Seller responded to the feedback: "Falschbehauptung. Ware funktioniert einwandfrei. Wir haben den Videobeweis!" The video proof probably being the video linked below.

24.03.2020

Seller sent a private message (not through ebay messaging system) threatening legal action, if the feedback wasn't removed. I asked the seller to proceed with the legal action, as I will not remove the totally honest feedback.

After sending the response, I reported the message as being a potential violation of the ebay "Member-to-member contact policy".

 

Videos

Video of SolarCosa receiving returned (the time and date is clearly visible):

Unpacking video, SolarCasa, Germany

Video of me trying to start the watch just before returning it (the time and date is clearly visible) - it moved only a few seconds and stops immediately:

SNZG13K1 not working video

Video of me trying to shake a 30 years+ watch in the same manner - it starts immediately (and runs for 50 minutes):

1990_seiko_5

 

 

Messages

28.02.2020  14:47 - Message

New message to: sun_and_more

Thank you for the swift delivery of my Seiko watch.

Unfortunately, it does not work! When I try to wind it by swinging it from side to side as listed in the manual, the seconds hand moves, but it stops immediately when I stop swinging it. Even after swinging it for more than a minute, the seconds dial (and watch) immediately stops when the swinging stops - it does not move even 1 second after the swinging stop.

I tried to search the for the correct way to wind it, but they do not do it in any other way than I have tried. When I look at the window at the back of the watch, it seems like the fly-wheel does not move freely and gets caught in some positions.

How do you suggest we fix this?

Best regards,
Johnny Norre

10.03.2020 19:17 - Message

New message from: sun_and_more (4,784Red Star)

Dear Sir or Madam!

The manufacturer SEIKO has informed us that the watch is not defective because it is an automatic watch without a manual wind. Please read the instructions carefully. It explains how to get the clock up and running. Now we hope you enjoy the beautiful watch. Sincerely, Cosa Wasu

 

10.03.2020 19:43 - Message

New message to: sun_and_more

I know it is an automatic watch and how an automatic watch works. I know the caliber 7S36 movement in the watch does not have manual winding, only automatic. As I explained, I've shaken the watch - as explained in the manual - to wind the automatic mechanism, but it does not wind. I assure you it is defective!

10.03.2020 21:28 - Message

New message from: sun_and_more (4,784Red Star)

If you are sure that the watch is defective please send it back. The adress is: SolarCosa, Rigaer Str. 3, 10247 Berlin. Best regards Li Minu

11.03.2020 11:05 - Case response

Hello Johnny,

sun_and_more sent you a message about your request:

Von einem Defekt der Uhr ist nicht auszugehen, sehr wahrscheinlich ist ein Anwendungsfehler. Wir akzeptieren allerdings die Rückgabe der Ware. Die Rücksendung muss zunächst auf Kosten des Käufers erfolgen. Soll

11.03.2020 - Case message to seller***

*** Ebay does not seem to let me view my messages in a closed case, so this is to the best of memory.

I informed the seller, that according to EU law and German law, that they (sun_and_more) had the burden of proof, that the item was NOT defective. This was not mentioned in their terms of sales.

I wrote this in English and used google to translate into German.

11.03.2020 12:20 - Case response

Hello Johnny,

sun_and_more sent you a message about your request:

Dear ladies and gentlemen, thank you for the informative legal information. We will of course adhere to these guidelines. In addition, we will check very carefully whether the watch shows signs of wear. If the return postage can be refunded, we need the receipt for our documents. Sincerely yours SolarCosa sehr geehrte damen und herren, vielen Dank für die informativen Rechtsbelehrungen. Wir werden uns selbstverständlich an diese Vorgaben halten. Darüber hinaus werden wir ganz genau überprüfen, ob die Uhr eventuell Tragespuren aufweist. Falls eine Rückerstattung des Rückportos erfolgen kann, benötigen wir den Quittungsbeleg für unsere Unterlagen. Mit freundlichen Grüßen SolarCosa

11.03.2020 Case message to seller***

*** Ebay does not seem to let me view my messages in a closed case, so this is to the best of memory.

Thanks for your message. The tracking number is XXXX.

12.03.2020 17:35 - Case response

Hello Johnny,

sun_and_more sent you a message about your request:

"Thanks."

Mail sent to my personal mail address at March 24th

Dear Sirs and Madames,

We are sorry that you are unsatisfied with the order. However, we have fulfilled our part of the purchase contract. That means we have sent you defect-free goods. The automatic watch works perfectly. was a problem with the correct operation.

Now, unfortunately, we found that you left a negative review. Of course, this is your right. However, in this case it is a false claim to say that the watch never worked. Therefore, I would politely ask you to remove them or, if necessary, to write a truthful assessment.

If the wrong evaluation was not removed by March 27th, 2020, we reserve the right to take legal action, although we would like to refrain from doing so.

 

Best regards from Berlin

Manfred Hartmann

 

Owner: Dr. . . Stefan Rauscher

Rigaer Str. 3

D-10247 Berlin

 

headquarters: +49 30 4280 2070

Fax center: +49 30 4280 2071

 

VAT ID No: DE 207874192

Tax number: 14/485/50243

 

www.solarcosa.de

www.experimentiershop.de

www.uhrenvielfalt.de

24.03.2020 My response to the letter above

Herr Hartmann,

Proceed legal action immediately. THE REVIEW WILL NOT BE REVISED.

How difficult is it to understand, that the watch DID.NOT.WORK when I had it. I was DEAD.ON.ARRIVAL. DEFECTIVE! I read the manual. I viewed videos on . I tried my OTHER AUTOMATIC WATCHES, which works without any problems. I even sent you a video, of the watch not working and that the same shaking made a 30 years old Seiko watch start immediately.

I sent you an email regarding the problem within 2 hours of receiving the watch. You waited 11 days (eleven) to answer the letter and just said "I works". Not "we are sorry to hear it does not work, but would you please try doing xxx" or anything, just "It works". Even after seeking a resolution from you, I tried shaking the watch every day, so see if it - by miracle - would start. IT DID NOT!

So you expect me to said, OK it does not work here, but SolarCosa says it works, so then everything is fine! Two times a day, it shows the correct time, so I better give the seller 100 stars and positive rating. Get a grip! How the f*ck do you think I felt, when I received a watch that would not run?????

The watch did not work! The video I sent you proves this as much as your video proves the opposite. I actually really wanted this specific watch (big numbers, 100m WR and a good lume) and your company had it at a very good price - but not so good a price that it is acceptable that it was defective.

Finally, apart from non-existing customer service (as mentioned above, why not tell me how to get the watch to work, instead of just saying "it works"), now you move to threaten with legal action (on what grounds?) - what a way to treat your customers!

 

Regards,

Johnny Norre